In this episode Wes Craig has a strong creative vision.

Topics include why the Deadly Class school is a Hogwarts of only Slytherins, not just drawing pretty pictures, design backgrounds, full-fledged cartooning, the importance of collaboration, psychological Luthor shenanigans, carnie hosts, his maybe upcoming graphic novel (!!!), and what he’s reading!

Links:

Transcript:

Matt: Kara, welcome back to Artist’s Alley.

Kara: Thanks, Matt.

Matt: We are here with Wes Craig, artist extraordinaire of Deadly Class. Welcome to the show.

Wes: Thanks a lot. Hello, everybody.

Matt: This is a big episode for us. Deadly Class is easily my favorite monthly book out right now.

Kara: Talks about it all the time.

Matt: I do, sorry. The pitch for that book, it takes place in the late 80s. It stars a lead character who’s down on his luck for lack of a better phrase and he joins a school for assassins and hijinx ensues.

Kara: I started reading it because one of my coworkers pitched it as Hogwarts except everyone’s a Slytherin.

Wes: That’s very true.

Matt: It’s like a R-rated Slytherin comic book.

Wes: All of these things that people are mentioning like Marcus has these things that were not on purpose but Marcus has a scar and Harry Potter has a scar. There was something else. I’m blanking on it. Some other major comparable thing between the two characters. I was like, “None of that was planned.” I don’t want to do the comparison thing too much. This means this or whatever, but it is quite true a house Slytherin, all Slytherin. All semi-evil characters.

Matt: We talked before we recorded about some 90s X-Men, but you started really early on in comic books. You were a fan growing up. Was that always your goal to be a monthly comic book artist and creator?

Wes: Yeah. As I’ve gotten older, after Deadly Class is done I’d like to try to approach maybe a graphic novel or something like that. That would be great, but I like things like Chris Ware and Optic Nerve and all that kind of indie side of comics, too. A lot. Ever since I was a kid, I didn’t want to be … There’s some people who like to draw, so it’s just a matter of “Where am I going to make money drawing?” They could be in animation or they could be in video games or comic books or whatever, they find their path. But, at least for me, it was just comic books. I didn’t really want to be in any other field. It was just comic books, always. Since I was a little kid.

Matt: Why is that? Why comic books?

Wes: When I started drawing when I was a kid, it wasn’t just drawing pictures. It was drawing comics. It wasn’t just that I like drawing pin-ups.

I’d always write and draw my own comics when I was a kid. It wasn’t just drawing pretty pictures, it was the story-telling of it. Even as a little kid, my first few experiences walking into comic shops, growing up … One of the first things I picked up was Will Eisner’s The Spirit and that’s from the 1940s, but I was really, really into it. I’m still proud of that to this day that I was into Liefeld and McFarlane and all the stuff that was coming out at that time, too. But I was also like oh there’s something different about these old comic books. It was all about his story-telling and how he breaks down the pages and in Deadly Class that’s still an influence. There’s a certain type of storytelling you can achieve in comics you can’t do with video games or animation or movies or novels or anything else. For the illustrations, that’s what I’m into.

Matt: You can see some of that, too. I remember when I first started reading The Spirit. I’m not sure what the term is, but the title page and specifically how he would weave that into the artwork was something I think left comics for very long period of time.

Wes: Yeah. I would love to do a bit more of that stuff. We don’t really have title pages, but I guess the covers can serve that purpose once in awhile. That’s one of his tricks. Just the fact that he was able to do every first page a different version of The Spirit hidden in the artwork. That’s one of the main inspirations. It went for a long time and he never just went with a pat, easy solution to that first page. It would always be some kind of interesting layout.

Kara: Going back to Deadly Class. The thing that is most arresting to me about that book is the layouts and how the panels are arranged. It’s unlike anything else that I’m seeing in comics now. Matt was telling me that you have a background in design and so that shows. What kind of elements are you drawing on when creating those pages?

Wes: I went to school for illustration and design. After that, I graduated from a year-long program in graphic design. I wasn’t in comics yet, so I was taking it just as a fall-back. “Just in case I don’t get into comics, I can have a graphic design diploma.” But, really the whole time I’m there, I’m like “How can I use this to fit into my comic books?” I don’t think it’s used enough. A lot of it’s just story-boarding. It feels like story-boards for a movie. I think comics work best when there’s a strong graphic design influence. That’s what it is. It’s static images on the page. It’s not a movie. That combination of text and image, that is was graphic design is. I think comic book artists should … Some people are amazing at it, but there’s room to incorporate it even more into comics.

Aside from the graphic design thing, there’s DC and Marvel stuff and then there’s the indie stuff that’s a bit more like Chris Ware, Acme Novelty Library, Optic Nerve and things like that. And then there’s images in the weird interesting spot in between those two worlds. I’m a big fan of that kind of stuff. When I look at Chris Ware comics, but also I’m trying to think of other people. David Mazzucchelli’s work after his Marvel work. Once he moved on to City of Glass and more recently his follow up and Rubber Blankets, he did in the 80s. That’s a huge influence on me and how they did their storytelling. There’s a million other influences that I’m blanking on right now.

Matt: Sure. I read previously where you had an interesting quote I’d never heard before. In terms of full fledged cartoonists, you wish people would try the other end. If you’re a writer, try to draw. If you’re an artist, try to write. Why would you want that for more storytellers?

Wes: I do a bit of that on the side for myself for Black Hand Comics, my thing where I get to write and draw and do all that. My favorite comics and my favorite movies are when you see a movie and you see the writer and director are the same person. You’re almost guaranteed it’s gonna be if not good, at least interesting. This person really had something to say. Their vision, they saw it through the whole way. It’s the same thing in comic books, I find. In Deadly Class, when we do …

Well, one of my first favorite comics when I was a kid was Marv Wolfman and George Perez on Teen Titans. I think they both lived in New York and met up before and talk about the story. If you can’t be one person on it, it’s nice to get as tight a collaboration as possible between the creators. My other favorite things are John Byrne and Frank Miller and Walter Sampson. That’s the stuff I grew up on. That was more a singular writer/artist vision. You have the idea and you have it in your head and you can just control the visuals more. You know exactly … The fewer people involved, the more strong vision, the stronger the product is at the end.

Matt: I remember I was reading John Byrne’s Superman Run for the first time last year.

Wes: So good. Under appreciated.

Matt: It is! There’s a bonkers Lex Luthor backup story where he pulls up to a café in the middle of nowhere and offers this waitress X amount of dollars to leave her life. “Break up with your fiance or husband to come with me.” The whole issue is how she deals with that decision and then coming close to that decision. He ends up just leaving her.

Wes: What a bastard.

Matt: It was the meanest thing I’ve ever seen in a comic book with Lex Luthor . But it was so well done. Because it’s a psychological Lex Luthor shenanigans.

Wes: Yeah. I think my favorite version of Superman aside from All Star Superman. I think John Byrne did a lot of … Man, I’m getting off on a tangent. Don’t get me started on that.

Matt: Please do.

Wes: It’s been forgotten, but all his enemies were based on technology and they were all corrupted by technology. Like Talon and Lex Luthor lost his hand because of that Tangorang. Superman represents the pr-technology farm world. Krypton is extremely bad at technology. He had something to say there, I think. Not that that is the Superman, but it was an interesting take on it that’s kind of been forgotten. I wish is still was used.

Matt: What about Black Hand Comics? You do that in the middle of breaks in Deadly Class.

Wes: Yeah.

Matt: It fascinates me that image has now started a trend of doing six issues, taking a few months of for the big books so you have the ability to dive back into Black Hand Comics. Which is your own pet project.

Wes: Yeah. I hate taking those breaks on Deadly Class, because I don’t want any readers to slip off and lose interest. It seems like our fan base is steady and very into it, so I don’t think anyone’s necessarily going to leave in between arcs, with that little break.

Matt: Yeah.

Wes: It really affords me some time on the side to do my own thing. And I love drawing and I love working with Rick. I like the collaboration. But I also have that part where I really want to have full control and be a control freak.

Matt: You want to be the John Byrne of your own thing.

Kara: (laughs)

Wes: Even coloring and lettering and controlling the entire aspect. I have certain things in mind for each aspect of comics and I want to have to the opportunity to do that. I get to scratch that itch while I’m working on Deadly Class, now. It’s slow going, because there’s still only a bit of time between issues. If I go to a convention, for example, then that erases that time. I wake up in the morning and before I get to work on Deadly Class I go to a coffee shop. I do a little writing, then go back home and get interested in Deadly Class. Just having that little bit of time, it’s kind of the perfect scenario for me. Like the best of both worlds.

Kara: How long does it take you to get through an issue of Deadly Class versus your creator-owned work?

Wes: It’s about five weeks for each issue of Deadly Class, penciling and inking. I don’t really give myself a deadline on the Black Hand stuff, that’s one of the things I enjoy. If the storytelling isn’t right then I’m not going to just say “Okay, well this page needs to get done.” I’ll just go insane on it, until I’m completely happy with it. Deadly Class I take it to a good of a level as possible. There are certain shortcuts that I do. But Black Hand, I don’t know. There’s no set timeline on it. It would be depressing to me if I wrote down exactly how long it takes me to do each story, so I don’t even bother.

Kara: How would you pitch Black Hand to someone who’s maybe familiar with your Deadly Class work but hasn’t heard of that yet?

Wes: It’s kind of a hard thing to pitch. Generally, I still have a lot good connections because people are interested in Deadly Class. They just see it like it’s the next side thing they can check out. It’s drawn in a different style. It’s much more influenced by Mike Mignola or more of a cartoon aspect. Deadly Class is more on the realistic side. Mainly it’s short stories. They’re unrelated to each other. There’s this character  called The Carnie who works like a EC comics like The Crypt Keeper or Rod Serling for Twilight Zone, who introduces the stories. But, that’s just to have one thing that connects them together. It’s from that world, it’s weird stories that are influenced by Pulp Fiction and EC comics and Twilight Zone. That eerie 1940s-50s world. Two of them are horror stories. One of them is a story about a boy lost at this circus in the 1930s. It’s pretty hard to-

Kara: I just got chills (laughs).

Wes: It’s just whatever I like doing, so it’s not glued together at all. That’s why The Carnie exists, I’m like “These stories have nothing to do with each other.” If it’s your thing, it’s your thing. If you like that kind of stuff, then I think you’d like it. But, I don’t do the hard sell, I’m like “Yeah, check it out. If you like it, you like it.”

Kara: That’s cool, though, that you get to do a variety of different stories and explore that.

Wes: Yeah, also I find it’s hard to keep the concentration. One of the things I’m thinking about doing is graphic novel bit by bit as I’m working on Deadly Class and maybe have it when I’m finished with Deadly Class one day. But, it’s hard to keep the concentration to keep it really consistent. Because, it’s doing three pages here and then doing Deadly Class and then doing three more pages. It’s hard. I think at the end it would feel choppy. That’s why, for now, I’m focusing on short stories that I can done in a small amount of time and then grouping them together in Black Hand. I think there will be a volume two one day.

Matt: That’ll be great. What do you seek out in your free time? What do you enjoy reading? What do you recommend to people that are listening?

Wes: I could mention Rick.

Kara: (laughs)

Wes: I was a fan of Rick before he offered me Deadly Class. When he called me up and pitched me, I was like “I don’t care. Whatever you have, we’re doing. Kids at assassin school? Sure.” No matter what. I was a fan of Fear Agent, Strange Girls, stuff like that. And his X-Force, too. It was kind of a done deal. But, aside from that I’m a big fan of … Ed Brubaker and Sean Phillips are probably my favorite team right now. Speaking of people who work really, really well together. It feels like it’s one mind. A little like Grant Morrison and Frank Quietly. They’re so perfect together. It’s meant to be. Anything that they do. All of the stories they’ve been doing for Criminal, to the Fade Out right now. A lot of that. A lot of Jason Aaron’s stuff. I love Scalped from back in the day, his current stuff like Southern Bastards I’m a big fan of.

Matt: So good.

Wes: And aside from that, a lot of Eleanor Davis, her book. I’m blanking on the name of the book.

Matt: We’ll get the intern on that. Get the show intern.

Kara: (laughs)

Wes: Yeah, just Google that. That’s great. What else? Let’s see… Whenever an Optic Nerve comes out, I love that. Love and Rockets is still amazing. Like I was saying, Chris Ware, it comes out really sporadically but when it does, it’s always great. It’s always very inspiring for me. I’ll be marking the pages and stuff like that. I steal a lot of that.

Matt: Sure (laughs). We don’t blame you. Well, I appreciate you taking the time out. We’re huge Deadly Class fans. We highly recommend every check it out. Black Hand Comics as well. Hopefully, maybe a graphic novel when Deadly Class ends, too.

Wes: Yeah, we’ll see. I’m hoping. There’ll be more work, whatever it turns into, I’m not sure yet. It kind of changes in my mind as the months go on. But, definitely more work now that I’m on Deadly Class.

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